Tom Perrin wrote:
At 10:36 AM 7/21/00 -0400, you wrote:
>A provocative question. But are the original documents still available?
>Wasnt' there a fire in Albany that destroyed a lot of stuff?


The 1911 State Capitol fire did indeed destroy many of the originals, but
countless others can still be found in repositiories across the world.

As I understand, and the people in the archives can surely enlighten us a
little better, many of the earlier documents, such as the Dutch records,
survived the fire because when shelves collapsed they buried the less used
materials that were kept down low and out of the way.  I have seen some
documents which were preserved but literally turned to charcoal and some
parchments which curled and crumpled into small balls from the heat and
water - ink still visible and in need of a way to unfold and restore.
There is nothing sadder than looking at the indexes of documents and maps
that were lost in the fire.

It would be a great exercise to go back to the Public Records Office and
the French and Dutch sources and locate the originals that O'Callaghan
transcribed and compare and re-write.  It is also believed that he left out
huge numbers of items which he didn't feel or recognize as important.

        Dan W.



>"Daniel H. Weiskotten" wrote:
>>
>> Now that my question about the availability of NYCD and DHNY has been
>> asnwered I would like to ask if anyone has ever done a study of the work
>> that he did and how he did it and how it has affected our interpretation of
>> New York State history.  I know that he was a latecomer to New York
>> history, having worn many hats before and after, but how did this one
>> series shape our interpretations and is there more?
>>
>> In my various projects I have come across other people's work of the same
>> sources that O'Callaghan used, such as the Livingston Indian Records and
>> manuscripts in the State Archives, and found that while O'Callaghan gives
>> what we believe to be a nice literal transcript of the original document,
>> it is actually a brief summary of what is in the original.  Case in point,
>> a destcription of the journey by Robert Livingston to Onondaga in 1697,
>> presented by O'Callaghan in NYCD IV:648-652 is but a shadow of what is
>> presented in the Livingston Indian Records :174-176, and as seen in the
>> original document to be found in Fenton, et al.'s massive Iroquois Indians:
>> A Documentary History" (microfilm reel 5, April 1697).
>>
>> I have seen other examples over the years, and I can only imagine what
>> wonders might be found if O'Callaghan's work were re-edited from the
>> original manusripts.
>>
>> Is this too massive to consider or has anyone been brave enough to do more
>> than just scan and stick the images onto CD?
>>
>>         Dan W.
>>         (fishing for something to do, but without the resources)
>>
>> At 03:28 PM 7/17/00 -0400, you wrote:
>> >>  ....  I am
>> >> wondering about whether anyone has ever gone to the trouble, such as the
>> >> folks at the Making of American, Lemoyne (Jesuit Relations), and other
>> >> text-scanning projects, to get this fantastic source  .....  onto the
web
>> >> where more people would be able to use them?
>> >
>> >** I don't know if they are on the web, but they are available on CDs
at $35
>> >a piece.   Very handy in my bookcase space.  Brodhead's 15 volume work,
>> >NYCD, was 'published' by the LeGrand J. Weller, 2301 Crestline,
Abilene, TX
>> >79602 -  915 677 9169 in 1999.    ISBN # not given on the CD.  The CD
>> >edition of  NYCD also include a piece by Cadwallder Colden and 'four
Munsell
>> >tracts, edited by O'Callaghan'.
>> >
>> >And O'Callaghan's DHNY, 1849 edition  (4 vols) is on another CD
'published'
>> >by  Fine Books COmpany, 984 Washington Blvd., Abilene TX 79601 / 915 673
>> >7603
>> >ISBN # 1886103-00-3.
>> >
>> >Ruth Piwonka
>> >Kinderhook, New York
>> >
>